“Whereas some brahmans and contemplatives, living off food given in faith, are addicted to watching shows such as these — dancing, singing, instrumental music, plays, ballad recitations, hand-clapping, cymbals and drums, magic lantern scenes, acrobatic and conjuring tricks, elephant fights, horse fights, buffalo fights, bull fights, goat fights, ram fights, cock fights, quail fights; fighting with staves, boxing, wrestling, war-games, roll calls, battle arrays, and regimental reviews — he abstains from watching shows such as these. This, too, is part of his virtue.”–Samaññaphala Sutta
“Where were the senior Tibetan Buddhist teachers advising the 17th Karmapa of the potential Vinaya breaking aspects of these Monlam concerts and other events?”
Recently, I was trying to piece together the heartbreak of what has happened to the pure, brilliant, handsome and brave 17th Gyalwang Karmapa since he came into India in 2000 and the corrupt and harmful influences around him that have led to his rather “stuck” and sorry situation today. Clearly, as I mentioned before, the Gelugpa sectarianism and the Thaye Dorje faction were the two biggest obstacles (and still are). There are sources closer to home too, including two-faced lamas from other lineages and Karma Kagyu who have tried to hedge their bets and even supported Thaye Dorje for political reasons connected to the Bhutanese royals connection with the 14th Zhamarpa’s personal assistant, Tobga.
However, not so much as been said about the worldly laypeople “clique” around the 17th Karmapa and several Vinaya-breaking concert events/dinners like this one in 2018 8in NYC, recorded for posterity on video for all to see (for more on that see below). This article aims to address that important (yet unspoken of) aspect. Without wishing to be the “party-pooper killjoy” (dakini style) there is a serious point about the Vinaya to be made here, and the corruption and neglect by senior monastics in relation to the young 17th Karmapa, and that is the main intent of the article.
Some might wonder about my loyalty and intent in writing this article, and even see it as an attack on the Karma Kagyu and the 17th Karmapa. I let my love, work, devotion and continued support be the proof of where I stand on that. This post is a rather a message, sent with love, to such laypeople around him to please stop and consider your conduct. Also, to request that the 17th Karmapa make a clear statement as to whether he intends to take monastic vows correctly this time, or to disrobe and be a layperson yogi practitioner. Without that, the Buddhist monastic sangha is in serious danger of lack of trust and disrepute by laypeople.
In addition, I make the sincere request that all those around the 17th Karmapa who still continue to eat slaughtered animals for pleasure or health, to please stop. The 17th Karmapa has taken a lifetime vow not to eat slaughtered animals and requested people not do so, and even said it could endanger and shorten his life! To request people to start thinking about how to best use their time and energy to get the 17th Karmapa back into India, to Asia and to Rumtek. Sent with love to the 17th Karmapa and Karma Kagyu and a wish that such obstacles can swiftly be removed!
Music? For the subtle humour/wit of the wisdom element, and of course some musical entertainment (for the non-monastics among us ha ha ) Who’s That Girl? by the Eurythmics, Enough is Enough: No More Tears by Barbara Streisand and Donna Summer, It’s my Party and I’ll Cry If I Want To by Leslie Gore. and Love is Stronger than Pride by Sade.
Written by Adele Tomlin, 16th November 2024.
The 2018 Karma Kagyu Marme Monlam concerts: who are these women?
A few weeks back, I came across some videos of the Karma Kagyu Monlam concerts in 2018 (one in Bodh Gaya and one in NYC, USA) at which many monastics (some fully ordained) were present. I was kind of shocked and saddened by what I heard and saw.
In the Vinaya code of conduct for monastics, it clearly states that monastics must not listen to music or entertainment even such as TV and Movies, that are not Dharma related. So chanting and listening to mantras is fine as is watching movies of documentaries about Dharma or Buddha. Buddha clearly taught that listening to music was a distraction that often causes desire, addiction and attachment in people, as does worldly forms of dancing. However, both these concerts were full of men and women performing and dancing to pop and traditional songs for the entertainment and desires of the masses.
In fact, the 2018 Marme Monlam concert in NY for the 9th North American Kagyu Monlam, has to be the worst Vinaya breach in terms of content but also (suprisingly) in terms of sexist regression. The Kagyu Office report of the event does not even name the three female MCs for the event. Instead referring to them as “young and beautiful” and asserting that their replacing the monks, who used to MC the Marme Monlam event previously, as progressive. Seriously. In fact, an important gathering (whether religious or secular) needs to be careful about the choice of MC. This is because it relates to ideology and values, and reflects the attitude of the organizers of the gathering.
One of the women I recognised as Tibetan TV presenter Tsering Kyi, the others I have no idea. The English speaking (blonde-haired) woman in the centre introduced herself as Anais/ey Yeshe, and I tried to find out who she was but there was zero information online about her, nor about the Chinese speaking woman in white. Please let me know, if you know who they are. [UPDATE: since publishing this article, I was informed that the Chinese woman is called Xiao Yao, a TV actress with zero substantive background in Karma Kagyu or Buddha Dharma].
If they are well-qualified and have substantive backgrounds in Buddha Dharma and Karma Kagyu tradition, it would be good to know, right? It seems rather sexist and disrespectful to refer to them only by their age and looks. I tried to find details about these two other women online but no joy. I also emailed the Danang Foundation and Kagyu Monlam organising committee, no response.
On a more general note, I thought the sexist, patriarchal era of having “dollybird” nameless MCs when women were just supposed to look good and speak nicely was long gone in the 1970s and Miss World beauty contests. Even having an”attractive” Tibetan TV presenter is questionable. If they wanted to raise the status of women at the Monlam events, why didn’t they replace the monk MCs with Karma Kagyu nuns or laypeople with a clear and recognised background in Dharma practice, translation or study or all three? If such women happened to be young and beautiful as well as having those qualities/qualifications that’s a bonus, but physical appearance should never be the first and most important quality, right? [1].
In prior Marme Monlam years the MCs were Khenpo monks who were all publicly known and named (one Tibetan speaker, English speaker), and had recognised substantive expertise, study and background in the Buddha Dharma. One pictured here, for example, is Khenpo Karma David Chophel, an oral interpreter and translator connected to the 17th Gyalwang Karmapa for many years. If I asked anyone in Karma Kagyu they would know who these men are and why they were chosen.
With all due respect, I do not think any of those venerable monks/khenpos were chosen for looking ‘young and beautiful”. And nor should they be. It is a Dharma event connected to the Kagyu Monlam. In any case, when I asked Khenpo David about who the women were, he told me he could not remember their names or faces, even though I had sent him a screenshot of them. This explanation seems rather disingenuous and defies credibility though. How is it possible that someone so closely connected to the 17th Karmapa and who MCed prior Marme Monlams be totally unaware or forgetful about the women who replaced him? Also, could he not ask someone who does remember these women? The more the identity and background of these women are concealed by some Karma Kagyu people, the more it begs the question, who are they and why were they chosen?
Pop star performances with zero connection to Buddha Dharma, Karma Kagyu or the 17th Karmapa
Since publishing my article, someone seriously, yet hilariously suggested that the Monlam concert was on a par with the 16th Karmapa watching Lhamo Tibetan opera shows at Rumtek. Seriously.
As an example of the types of worldly music provided for masses of ordinary monastics for entertainment at the Marme Monlam concert, have a listen to this lovely and moving song sung by British singer Nicola Roberts, formerly of the pop group Girls Aloud . Like watching TV talent shows, it is entertaining no doubt, but the song is a worldly one and although suitable for laypeople to listen to and entertained by, such kinds of songs breach the Vinaya rules for all the hundreds of monastics who were also there. Buddha discouraged listening to such songs for monastics because they generate desire, craving, attachment and suffering in oneself and others. They can also waste people’s time, when monastics should be studying or practising Buddha Dharma. I wonder if Nicola Roberts got paid for this worldly (not world) music performance.
I was informed by Chloe Roberts (see below) that the 17th Karmapa himself had handpicked the musical acts and curated the show. So, can someone please explain to me how this pop song or singer is related to (or suitable for) such a major Buddha Dharma event at which hundreds of monastics attended? Roberts also informed me curtly not to email her about the event (why not?) and also that she did not follow the Karmapa as his student anymore. So that’s the thanks the Karmapa gets for giving her such a huge ‘gig’ in London like that, broken Vajra samaya. Excellent wisdom, right?
If the Karma Kagyu organisers are serious about male and female equality, perhaps at the next Marme Monlam extravaganza, we can have three ‘handsome hunk’ men for the nuns and laywomen audience? Or is it only women who are allowed to be viewed in such ‘objectifying’ ways by men? we all know the answer to that, right?
London starry skied and eyes event 2017, organised by a British pop star manager, Chloe Roberts
The 17th Karmapa’s visit to London the year before in 2017 was perhaps an omen/sign of this type of event to come. I remember attending the 2005- 2008 Kagyu Monlams and noticed even then the many laypeople as a clique around the 17th Karmapa, one of whom was Chloe Roberts, a British business woman and pop music star manager. I avoided these social cliques who seemed to spend most time in Bodh Gaya hanging out in cafes and restaurants socialising. Personally, I am more of a loner anyway, and generally find chatting aimlessly in restaurants a waste of time. I noted they were also rather “bitchy” and hyper protective of their “seniority” when it came to people who might be a potential “threat” to their social clique and “positions” [2].
Chloe (who no doubt means well) kindly organised and even gave a nice speech at the 2017 pop concert like event in London for the 17th Karmapa’s first visit there. Much as I would have loved to have seen the 17th Karmapa in my home country of the UK, causes and conditions ensured I did not go. Frankly, entertaining and glitzy and “contemporary” as these events were, they are not really my ‘cup of tea’ (as we Brits say) and are certainly far removed from what the Buddha intended for monastics, as he clearly taught that music was a distraction and causes desire, addiction and attachment in people, as does dancing.
Celebratory musical entertainment and laywomen guests at dinner in 2018
Also, there was this celebratory dinner and music event in 2018 the US, where the 17th Karmapa was publicly seated with other fully ordained monastics, and Dechen Drupon Rinpoche next to two unknown young Asian women, whom he spent quite a bit of time chatting to one in particular.The music at the event included rap and guitar solos. It was not Dharma chanting or mantras.
Where was the wisdom in that? Either the 17th Karmapa is the senior respected head of a 900 year old lineage, and a monastic or he is not? If not, then let’s just have a statement being clear about that, as there are many monastics who think he is a monastic and look to him as their example. Someone even wrote to me recently criticising that I had reported that the 17th Karmapa was not a monastic (according to his own words in 2019!).
Conclusion: the 17th Karmapa, Vinaya and monastics practising secret mantra with consorts
Where were the senior Tibetan Buddhist teachers advising the 17th Karmapa of the potential Vinaya breaking aspects of these Monlam concerts and other events? I love the 17th Karmapa and I love music too, but I am a layperson and have not taken any monastics vows nor wear monastic robes. In any case, the 17th Karmapa has been teaching about Vinaya rules over the last few years, so seems to be taking this a lot more seriously these days.
In sum, some people might rightly surmise that these events and laypeople also had a negative influence on the 17th Karmapa (and the Karma Kagyu lineage activities and preservation) in terms of worldly attitudes and habits. In fact, it seems some are still hanging around the Karmapa, as we all saw with the recent photos of three such laypeople in meeting with the 14th Dalai Lama in Zurich, Switzerland. The photos it seemed brought a lot of joy seeing the two senior lineage teachers together after so long, but has it made any difference to the 17th Karmapa’s current inability to return to India and travel and teach freely in Asia in person?
The jury is out on this one, as we say, but even though I love music, watching those 2017-2018 videos made me cringe constantly for the reasons given above. Have they really benefited the Karma Kagyu lineage teachings and the 17th Karmapa? If the Karmapa wants to attend such events and hang around laywomen and have consorts (as the 15th Karmapa did) then let’s be clear and honest about that. Otherwise, it just makes the Buddhist monastic sangha look corrupt and bad. Indian mahasiddhas had to leave the monasteries if they had female consorts, for similar reasons. The 15th Karmapa had several consorts, some of whom he is said to have never met (including a woman whose letters to him inspired him deeply).
Such Vinaya breaking and monastic corruption is not limited to Karma Kagyu of course, in fact the Gelugpas themselves have faced much criticism recently from myself and other scholars for their misuse of mass highest yoga tantra empowerments like Kālacakra, and worldly beings for political and social purposes.
UPDATE: Unknown English-speaking MC and refusal to reveal her identity by Tibetans in the US and Karma Kagyu people associated with the Marme Monlam concerts
As an update to this post, even though this woman (the English-speaker MC at the 2018 Marme Monlam concert) took such a prominent role at the two hour musical extravaganza concert, an event hosted and attended the the 17th Gyalwang Karmapa and hundred of monastics, no one seems to know who she is, or does not want to say. The woman introduces herself as ‘Aney/Anais Yeshe’. She may be a Tibetan or mixed race Tibetan living in North America, her accent is American. Is she even still alive? There is no online bio presence for her at all by that name, which is also odd. One thing is certain, she has zero substantive/publicly recognised background in the Buddhist field. Nor even as a celebrity TV presenter (like the other two women MCs) However, she is also unknown to people who have spent years within Karma Kagyu and close to the 17th Karmapa himself.
As an example of the refusal to divulge her identity, Chloe Roberts, who organised the 2017 London trip/events for the 17th Karmapa refused to say who she is when I asked her in an email. If she did not know she could easily find out as several of the musical acts who performed at that Monlam were connected to her she revealed. The 17th Karmapa’s oral interpreter, Khenpo David Chophel refused to say who she was, saying he did not know (and did not care). I also asked the TV presenter, Tsering Kyi, who was one of the female MCs at the event and she did not respond. Incredulous as that is, neither of them kindly offered to find out from Tibetans in the US who organised the event.
Such a simple question for a person’s identity who played a prominent public role at the 17th Karmapa’s Monlan concert, has led to a strange revelation that the woman is completely unknown to Tibetans in North Amercia, or her identity is being deliberately concealed (for no given reason). What is the BIG secret about this woman’s identity and her role?
Isn’t it disrespectful and also bizarre not to give her name and background at all, or as Khenpo David told me in an email, to say that they are ‘irrelevant’ and people do not care who they are. Answers on an email postcard please! 🙂
Endnotes
[1] Ironically, myself a qualified and published graduate Dharma scholar and translator with the most prolific output on Karma Kagyu Kagyu and Karmapas in the English language, has been attacked and my efforts demeaned by detractors for my being “beautiful” physically, from people within Karma Kagyu too. So it seems they are saying you can be one but not the other. How dare a woman be both! As when the Gelugpas blocked me in 2006 from becoming the English teacher of the 17th Karmapa in Dharamsala citing that I was too “young and beautiful” only then a few months later after having studied Tibetan language more, to then request I train to become an oral interpreter for one of the Gelugpa Geshes there! Proving they were trying to poach me to “the Gelugpa sectarian” institutions in Dharamsala, so it was nothing to do with trying to protect the Karmapa from being near an attractive woman etc. I am grateful the LTWA published my first two books though, only to then later try and ‘bury’ said publications for being ‘too negative about Tibetans’ (meaning Gelugpas)!
[2] I remember going to see the 17th Karmapa in Dharamsala around 2012 in a private audience, and asking him for a small text to translate for a forthcoming postgraduate degree on Tibetology in Europe, armed with a letter from the Director of the Library of Tibetan Works and Archives, in which the Geshe had also introduced me as a promising and talented student of the LTWA requesting the Karmapa to give a Karma Kagyu text for me translate. I was surprised when the 17th Karmapa threw the letter on the table and said “Geshe who?” When I explained to him the Director of the LTWA, he gave the impression he did not know who I was speaking about (or did not care), but kindly told me he would think of a text for me to translate.
After the short meeting, one of the social clique, a Tibetan man Tashi who leads the “media team” came up to me and rudely asked me how I had even dared to request such a thing, that I was not a scholar, and that I should never have been allowed to have an audience with the Karmapa to ask such a thing, ha ha ha seriously! Little did he know then what I could, and would go on to create and produce, all with the blessing and merit of karma, and of the Karmapa and Karma Kagyu lineage transmissions and teachings, without the help of any such social clique at all!
dear, we admire your hard work which is wasted in the dharma ending age anyway; the kk lineage is gone all wrong; better follow the dharma and stay safe alone;
Thank you, for your concern and kind comments. Stay safe alone? There is no safety alone or with people in samsara. I do not think so, I love the Karma Kagyu and Gyalwang Karmapa and Buddha Dharma. We do not abandon or trash things we love. In any case I have Vajra samaya with him and am bound to him until full awakening and vice versa. Vajra samaya is not some worldly thing one abandon/divorce when the going gets tough etc.